I should forget this stupid egotistical idea forever, right?

[Snaga]

A long long time ago, there was an RPG. It spanned many threads, involved many great RPers, and lasted for several forum years. I refer to the Hope and Despair series.

The tale grew in the telling. It spun in and out of events in first the "Government Councils" forum, that you can see in the Mathom house if you have a mind. It spun in and out of the Chronicles, from the later days of MERPG.com. Still it grew. Ultimately, as the Chronicles began to fall apart under their own weight, still I had hopes for it. To me, it was nothing less than the tale of end of the Fourth Age, and I had conceived that, through the conclusion of Hope and Despair, would come a final end to the Chronicles.

Perhaps I over-reached myself. Perhaps I am inclined to grandiosity (I know this to be true). Perhaps this ambition was foolish. However you feel about this, real-life intervened, and all of it came to nothing.

But strangely, though all of this was so long ago, I find myself still to be invested in that story. It still longs to be told. So its with sadness, that it seems that all the threads from the old MERPG are gone. You can see the first 4 threads of Hope and Despair in the Mathom House, if you like. But the continuation is gone - and with it some of the best writing of all, I fancy. I'd actually saved them onto a laptop, meaning to edit it all together into a single volume. I had actually even embarked on cutting out all the inconsistencies of tense, the typos, the oocs, the bits where the timeline was wrong. I was going to fill in the gaps where jumps were made as various threads trailed to nothing. I was going to incorporate the best of the Chronicles, and the great wars of the forum. Who could leave out the great war platform carried high by four mumakil, from which the warmasters of Mordor looked down upon the battle field and directed the fray? Well do I remember the fall of Minas Tirith. What of the great defence of Arnor by its beleaguered people? But what too of the stirrings of rebellion, from the most unlikely source, from the black heart of the Corsair, Serewing?

It was to be a composition, a selection - bringing together all the best work of many hands - to be a legacy for TTF. I wanted us to be able to say: "We did this!" And I wanted to bring it to a conclusion, the finale it had always deserved.

Of course, it would not have been brilliant. Those with no relation to TTF would for certain thought nothing good of it! So, maybe, maybe I should just forget it. The threads have gone - irrevocably, am I right?

Yay once asked me how the story was going to end. Unfortunately, I don't really want to give a simple synopsis of the ending. Something tells me not to. I guess I should just let go of this whole thing, right?:(

[Daranavo]

Well, I am one not to enjoy going backwards. What was written was written and read by those involved in it. It will live in their memories, hopefully fondly. Those who have come to the site and moved on, have moved on. It is ok to look back and hopefully, you do it with a smile. Such a thing then, was completely and utterly worth-while.

The site has changed as well as most of those who frequent it. Change is inevitable but it is neither good or bad as long as people still get enjoyment from the site and from each other.

When I read threads posted by others who seem to "miss" the times here years ago, is that because the time they spend here now is lacking in some way? That the people here and the stories they write are not very notable? Well, I have read in the archives when they existed long ago and there was some really good writing there but also now to. I remember you Scatha, from long ago, when I was...someone else here. I to had gone away for a time until the itch was unbearable. I have actually written with you before, as well as others, some of whom are here now, writing. If you have the itch still, join in if you want but repeating what was already wirtten to me, seems strange. *bows*

[Turgon]

Strangely enough, YayGollum and I were talking about Hope and Despair on MSN last week. I don't think it is simply a case of looking back fondly on those RPs, they were something great, they seemed to bring out the best in all the 'chroniclers' just as the chronicles themselves (sometimes) brought out the worse. Depths of Despair is where I cut my Role Playing teeth on TTF. I can still remember with total recall Serewing's first meeting with Snaga and the Corsair's attempt at the ill-fated 'Belfalas Bluff'. Despair still has a legacy on another forum, where the Wolf Rangers of Umbar still ride forth.

I actually think though, that ending Hope and Despair in one form or another would be something worthwhile, and if the story was finished, setting it down as a lasting legacy for the RPers of the Tolkien forum, both past, present and future, would be the mischief. I'd certainly be up for it. Snaga dropped me a few hints back in the day about where things were leading, and it sounded pretty climactic to me. Daranavo, I don't think it is really about repeating something that was already written, but writing something that should have been finished.

How you would go about that without certain characters I don't know. Mormegil's character was instrumental to the story I think? Anyways, for what it's worth I'd certainly have Serewing ride again. I'm interested to see where you are going with this Snaga. I'm sure I'm not the only one.

[Snaga]

No, definitely don't want to just go on a huge nostalgia thing. I think I now know how Tolkien could have a story develop slowly over so many years, and even putting it aside for long periods, but always wanting to return to it. In this case, having developed a story in my head but never having seen it told, it still really rankles. Looking back, I realise how much time actually went into it all!

But still, with so much lost from MERPG, I'm just not sure what can be done it with it. I wonder if anyone has it backed up somewhere? That's probably not realistic.

[YayGollum]

Actually, I noticed that the M. E. R. P. G. stuff had disappeared a while ago and asked the Webmaster person about it. He said that he'd bring the thing back. I haven't whined at him especially recently about it, though, but it sounds like all of the stuff still exists. I shall toss another Private Message thing at him about it. Anyways, I would muchly enjoy reading the unabridged director's cut of the Hope and Despair series. As well as, as a matter of course, playing in any bits that'd still need to be played out. I have gotten a bit better since my first posts in that story. :rolleyes: But then, I always enjoyed the fact that so many of so many differing skill levels were able to take part in that story. Added a different kind of variety, besides just your different personalities. Garn, though! Evil Radagast? :rolleyes:

Greetings, yet again. I have edited this merely to mention that I tossed another Private Message thing at that Webmaster person, who has informed me that the stuff shall come back as soon as he gets around to it. Hasn't been lost. Say, "Yay!"

[Snaga]

Yay!! Thanks Yay, that is good news!

I will continue to cozen this idea. As for playing it out, that might be possible, and it'd be more in the RPing spirit than me just writing it. I think I might like that.:D It would take some preparation, which might not be quickly achieved. I'll think it over.

[Turgon]

Also Snaga, if you don't feel you have the time for RPing, I for one don't mind writing some parts for my characters and giving them to you to add in the final piece. Of course that may prove more trouble than it's worth. I think Artos and Serewing may have given you something of a headache when they defected during the chronicles? Anyways, I guess what I am saying is that if you don't feel like actually opening up a new RP, there would still be help on hand to finish the tale. Not just by myself I am sure. Good to know that the third part is not lost however.

[chrysophalax]

The wolves and I are more than ready to continue on, Snaga. Despite the fact that a certain wizard (who shall remain nameless) laid the grandaddy of curses on my poor innocent head, I want to finish this! Serewing and I have much unfinished business, so cozen quickly!

Wow, Yay! Great news on the MERPG stuff! Excellent work!

[Snaga]

I am encouraged! OK, well I am starting to think it through. I have a little worry that without being able to see how it got left, we might end up with a bunch of horrible continuity errors!

At some point, I was meant to deliver the big 'reveal' at which the point of all (or at least most) that had gone before was explained, to set up the final conflict. To be quite honest, I can't at all remember what was and what wasn't explained.

I also can't remember exactly which characters were alive, and who was not!! Well... I think I do know, but I'm not 100%. That would be funny!:D But not the best.;) But I think I can remember enough to start to sketch out some what will happen. I have some key ideas already, that I have known for some time.

As for Serewing and Artos, their defection was emphatically NOT foreseen by me, but is not unwelcome for that. I think Artos' battle with his nature is fascinating. One of the things that made Hope/Despair such fun was the surprise turns - I recall Elessar's kidnapping in the original Hope thread caught me completely unawares. It did create some timeline questions for me, but before my laptop got stolen I had resolved that, so I'm sure I can do it again!

The most challenging bit is to consider how to satisfactorily conclude each of the many subplots and strands, without overwhelming the main story. But I'm up for the challenge!

[Snaga]

Ho hum... well just so you know, I've done some work on a synopsis of the story so far. Not quite ready to post just yet but maybe its not too far off. Well, I suppose its a bit more of a synopsis because it ties together lots of Hope/Despair stuff with the Chronicles background, messes gently with the timeline to remove some continuity errors, adds in a bit of further backstory, and will hopefully take it to point where the story could be playable to a conclusion.

Then it will need a further post from me, to kick things off in the right direction.

I know its been almost a year since I raised the spectre of doing this. I've rejected doing the director's cut, at least until the MERPG stuff comes back. But really, when I made an attempt at it, the task seemed overwhelming. I have in my head another writing project that would take precedent if I ever found that sort of time.:o

As Hope/Despair always was like this, I think its ok for anyone to join as long as they stay in keeping with the general theme. Also, I'm not promising or expecting lots of continual activity. All I can say is I want to get to the end, with whoever will help.:)

[Nóm]

Webmaster said this recently in the "Changes" thread:
The Middle-earth RPG material is still around.

It actually shouldn't that much of an adventure (for one familiar enough with Tolkien's works) to find it.
Whatever that means...:rolleyes:

[YayGollum]

Here are all of the links that I know of, if they could be useful to anyone. --->http://www.thetolkienforum.com/showthread.php?t=3413
http://www.thetolkienforum.com/showthread.php?t=4267
http://www.thetolkienforum.com/showthread.php?t=4807
http://www.thetolkienforum.com/showthread.php?t=3221
http://www.thetolkienforum.com/showthread.php?t=3195

And, as always, I am ready to jump back into this story.

[chrysophalax]

Ready when you are, orc lord.:D *toothy dragon grin*

[YayGollum]

Haven't been able to find anything else, though. I read that there was supposed to be something else. Yay for the quote from that Webmaster person, but I figure that being less of an expert on computer type things is keeping me from finding more stuff.

[Snaga]

This is might be where it is? It asks for a username and password, but I think I don't have clearance! http://www.thetolkienforum.com/merpg