Dernhelm

[L.Greenleaf]

I am re-reading ROTK and I had forgotten that Eowyn was disguised as Dernhelm. I was wondering if you all think PJ will add this to the movie? I think he has to because then how else will Eowyn meet Faramir, right?

[PipaHappyHobbit]

I think he will have to. Becuase she has to kill the nazgul. (with Merrys help of course) That's something that has to be in there.

[FoolOfATook]

I'm curious as to how PJ is going to be able to disguise Eowyn as Dernhelm. Since the Riders Of The Mark don't wear helmets with face-shields, it will be difficult to present on screen.

[Odo Proudfoot]

He can always stick a Groucho Marx moustache on her.

Odo

[Mischievious Merry]

Lol good one ODO!!!:D :cool: :) ;) :p
Mischievious Merry

[L.Greenleaf]

FoolofaTook I was womdering the same thing. I mean he has to disguise her so she can actually go to battle. I am sure many people who haven't read the book will be totally surprised at that part.

[Mirabella]

I don't think it will be too hard for Eowyn to transform herself into Dernhelm. Assuming PJ goes with book events, the Darkness will have begun when the Rohirrim ride to Minas Tirith. Eowyn clad as a Rider with a dirt-smudged face could easily be mistaken as on of the younger soldiers in the gloom.

[L.Greenleaf]

Very true Mirabella. I can't wait to see ROTK. PJ sure has a load of things to add to it. I wonder what he will be taking out?

[Ghan-buri-ghan]

I think its a dangerous assumption that Eowyn and Merry will kill the Witch king.

I think this event, and many other things are up for grabs in RotK.

[*Lady Arwen*]

I think they put a hood on her so you can't see her face, like they did with Aragorn at the Prancing Pony.

[Remnant]

I hope it is in .. They need her and Merry to get hurt so they can go to the HOH ..
I agree that If you dress her in a raggy, dirty, stained , uniform and dirty her up ... she will look like a young boy ...

On one thread somewhere they had a laugh at the young boy Aragorn talks to about his sword before the fight at helms deep .. some thought that Aragorn called him 'alice'??? :O

They need her to realize SHE has to take control of her life ...
How they break her spirit? Will probably be Aragorn and Arwen somehow>
... So she will sneak away to fight ... remember she fears being CAGED ... and they are caging her; leaving her with the children and women all the time!!

Go; eowyn! ... WE need her to meet Faramir :)
Sorry everyone, I like the love stories in all the battleling ... it is so good!!
It balances the movie and gives the characters depth!! :)

[Mirabella]

Eowyn and Merry just *have* to kill the WitchKing. If PJ tampers with that story line, I think he will be tarred and feathered and run out of town on a rail! What would be the point of even having their characters in the film if he's going to deny them their moment of glory?

[PRH]

I wouldn't worry about Eowyn not killing the Witch King. Why would this be changed? It'd be akin to making Pippin the Ringbearer. Also, Merry needs to use his gift-dagger so I can't imagine they'll excise him from the scene.

I don't think it'll be too hard to disguise Eowyn as Dernhelm. The real question is, will the audience be 'in on it' the whole time or will it be like the book where we don't know that Dernhelm=Eowyn until she encounters the Witch King? I hope it plays like the book, but this brings the added challenge of tossing in a 'new character' in the form of Dernhelm.

[L.Greenleaf]

WOW you all have very good points. I also hope PJ allows Eowyn and Merry to kill the witch king. I mean Eowyn has to get hurt somehow in order to go to the HOH to meet Faramir. Merry deserves his chance to be a hero and if PJ doesn't add this then I think it will be terrible. I also love the part when Merry wakes up in the HOH and says "I am hungry". That is a great line and I will love to see that on film.

[Éomond]

I couldn't think of anyone else that PJ would rather have kill the Witch-king than Éowyn and Merry.

All Éowyn would have to do is wear Rohirrim war gear and put her hair up and hide it in her Helm and then dirty her face.

[33Peregrin]

Yeah... I agree. I don't think it would be very hard to disguise Eowyn. Though it may confuse a few non - LoTR peoples that go, if she, OK never mind.
I don't see why PJ wouldn't have Eowyn and Merry kill the Nazgul. I think the movie characters are leading up to this great moment quite nicely so far. I don't see why he would change this unless he wanted thousands of angry fans out to cut his throat!!!
I think PJ is doing fairly well so far.

[PRH]

Originally posted by Éomond
I couldn't think of anyone else that PJ would rather have kill the Witch-king than Éowyn and Merry.
Agreed. If Eowyn and Merry don't kill the Witch King, then it'll mean the Witch King simply doesn't get killed. They're not going to substitute anyone else.

[Dáin Ironfoot I]

I can see it now:

-----scene with Merry and Eowyn to show their relationship----

1. Aragorn rejects Eowyn on coming to the Paths

2. She cries, runs into town, and a scene shows her with a sword, a light in her eyes, her face resolute.

3. Pelennor Fields, Dernhelm is shown killing Orcs, a hint is given that 'he' is a 'she', maybe a cry, or a yell... something, her eyes maybe...

4. Eowyn rips off her helm, all the non LOTR people scream! Her face is dirty and bloodied, her hair draped over her shoulders, her eyes bugging out like they did when she "fought" Aragorn...

5. Big overdramatized scene between her and Nazgul, possibly including a sword duel... (not kidding either)

6. Faramir finds her on the fields, barely alive.

I bet that is how it will be done...

[Éomond]

Originally posted by Dáin Ironfoot I

6. Faramir finds her on the fields, barely alive.


That seems like a very good PJ idea, I could/might be done, and it seems like a good movie climax that I would mind seeing. As long as their relasionship is the same. :)

[Mirabella]

I want Eomer to be the one to find her on the field. I want to see him lose it and go charging into the legions of Mordor. Faramir can take Imrahil's place and be the one who discovers Eowyn is still alive.

[PRH]

If Faramir is not wounded and in the Houses of Healing at this point, what excuse does he have for not going to the Black Gate? Will he not be nearly burned alive by Denthor?

Maybe he will go to the gate...

[Dáin Ironfoot I]

I bet we'll see Arwen in Minas Tirith too... in the battling. Grr...

[Mablung]

Shes bringing Anduril to him I believe. Anyway I think a Nazgul sword fight would be cool obviously not with Arwen but possibly with Gandalf (a normal Nazgul not the Witch King because that would be out there)

[Frodogirl57]

I think that they have to put Dernhelm in. It shows how brave Eowyn can be and how she can fight like any man.

[Mirabella]

Even if Faramir does take over for Imrahil in the movie, that doesn't preclude him from being wounded and nearly burned alive by his father. I don't think he will go to the Black Gate: he and Eowyn will have to spend time together in the HoH.

[PRH]

Remember, the Witch King dies after Denethor burns himself. To have Faramir find Eowyn's body and still nearly get scorched with Denethor will require some major time shifting.

[Dáin Ironfoot I]

Well that shouldn't be too hard for good ole' PJ now, should it? :rolleyes: Perhaps Faramir wont even be taken to be burned with Denethor, thats what I think anyways. They will probably change it so Faramir does get injured (knocked unconscious) by trying to save someone to show he really isnt such a bad guy after all. Then he will awake and see Eowyn fall after killing the Witch King and carry her back, collapse in front of the gates... you know real dramatic like. Then they'll both be carried to HoH.

Plausible no?

[Mirabella]

Hmmmm...you are correct, PRH. Ok...new theory! Faramir has a larger role in the Battle of the Pellanor, is wounded much later than in the book, and is spared the ordeal of being nearly burned alive by his father. He and Eowyn are taken from the field together to the HoH. It will be Gandalf who discovers Eowyn is still alive.

[PRH]

I think Faramir will (as in the book) take no part in the Battle of Pelennor Fields. I think he'll be wounded defending Osgiliath as in the book and it'll go from there just like the book. I think they might show a good deal more of the battle at Osgiliath before the Pelennor battle in which Faramir will come across as a solid hero.

Here's why I think this:
1) Phillippa Boyens (screenwriter) has said that a big part of ROTK will be about fathers and sons. This sounds odd to me since there's plenty of major book material to cover without expanding the rather minor plot of the father son relationship between Denethor and Faramir (which other father/son relationship is there? perhaps Theoden/Eomer will be treated as such?). Anyway, the major culmination of the Denethor/Faramir story would be Denethor burning.

2) I remember a report from TORN where 'Quickbeam' visited the set. They actually let him get in a Gondorian soldier costume and be an extra in a scene where Faramir leaves departs to defend Osgiliath. The extras were all supposed to act like they were so distraught to see Faramir leave.

3) I also remember a report from AICN from where Harry visited the set. There was a reference to multiple takes of a scene where Faramir was being dragged pierced by arrows and unconscious by a horse back to Minas Tirith. Harry also describes a different part of the scene in #2 between Faramir and Gandalf with Gandalf urging Faramir not to rashly throw his life away on his father's account, as Faramir readies to leave on horseback in full armour.