The True Villain of the Lord of the Rings

Discussion in '"The Lord of the Rings"' started by HLGStrider, Jun 12, 2005.

?

Who is the true villain?

  1. Sauron

    40.7%
  2. The Ring

    15.3%
  3. Evil as a force, or Melkor

    28.8%
  4. Other

    13.6%
  5. Saruman

    1.7%
  1. Ingolmin

    Ingolmin Member

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    Most important thing is that villain is a term for a being not for an effect or phenomenon!

    Illuvitar was not a source of evil or creator of chaos, he was the creator himself, evil was one of the lesser manifestations of his nature as is in a God, it does not represent the god itself! For eg- Matter comes from the The Absolute God but are his inferior manifestations, and he is not affected from them.
    The true villain is Melk0r himself, the master of Sauron. In broad sense, Sauron can be said as villain in the Lord of Rings but Sauron was doing only what Melkor would have done in his place. The seed of all evil was implanted by Melkor himself when the Music was being sung.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 12, 2017
  2. Andy*

    Andy* Member

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    The evil one in me wants to say Peter Jackson...:eek::p:D
    Just kidding...
    That said no offense to those here who enjoy the movies... they just aren't for me.

    I'd vote for Melkor as the root of evil in Middle earth with Sauron as the villain in the Lord Of The Rings.
    Andy
     
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  3. The Elvish Minstrel

    The Elvish Minstrel Obssessed with Elves <3

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    Lol!!! ;)

    Sometimes I kinda feel sorry for guys like Peter Jackson and George Lucas. :D
     
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  4. Andy*

    Andy* Member

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    Glad to see that you took my comments lightheartedly... ( that was the spirit in which I wrote 'em :D )
    Andy
     
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  5. The Elvish Minstrel

    The Elvish Minstrel Obssessed with Elves <3

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    ;)

    Personally, I liked how nice you were about your dislike for the movies, instead of just saying something like, "if you like them your stupid" or something like that. :D
     
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  6. Andy*

    Andy* Member

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    Thanks!
    It is not for me to say that someone is stupid for liking something I do not.
    We all have different tastes , needs and desires and as long as those tastes , needs and desires cause no harm... What is the big deal if someone likes something that I do not?

    Maybe the true villain in The Lord of the Rings is the evil that is brought into the world through good intentions or "justified measures"?
    Kinda like how The Ring tries to seduce Boromir and others... into taking and using The Ring for "good" and fighting Sauron or "righting his wrongs" etc... Just a thought before coffee....:eek::D
    Andy
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2017
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  7. The Elvish Minstrel

    The Elvish Minstrel Obssessed with Elves <3

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    Speaking of, I've always liked Sam and Faramir for resisting the ring (not that others haven't too, like Gandalf and Galadriel).
     
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  8. Andy*

    Andy* Member

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    Well I am re-reading The Lord of the Rings ... so we shall see , if my thoughts change on just who is the true villain is here...
    It could be my job ... Pesky students getting in the way of reading time!..:D
    Andy
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2017
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  9. Sulimo

    Sulimo Registered User

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    Sauron no question he is The Lord of the Rings. However, the significance is that you don't see him. How much more terrifying is the evil in your imagination versus the evil given flesh. Think about Stephen King's It for example.

    One could also argue that the destructiveness of pride is as much the main villain in the books. For Sauron himself fell victim to his pride when he refused to travel back to Valinor for judgement of his actions at the end of the First Age. Pride is a hallmark of human nature and the opposite end member, which I would argue is not in our nature at all, is humility. When we are humble it typically is a result of moving in the opposite direction of our survival instinct. It is a paradox: die to live, but that is humility. I also believe this paradox is the core message of the books. It explains why the council chose to destroy the ring instead of use it, and why they sent 2 hobbits into Mordor. Also it's why Sauron never saw it coming.

    A less abstract example would be the quote above when Galadriel passed the test in refusing the ring she overcame her pride, and displayed humility. She had an opportunity to be the supreme ruler of Middle Earth. She was of noble bearing in Middle Earth of higher standing than even Elrond one could argue, but she gave it all up and decided to return to a land where the Vala rule. She would be just another elf and her father would be the one who ruled over the affairs of others. It is interesting to consider that for the entire third age she was the dominate elf in middle earth after the fall of Gil-Galad, and now she is willing to give it all up. She had finally atoned from the Doom of Mandos.

    This highlights that everyone except Bombadil possess in their base nature an incompatibility with goodness. Those who are wise know not to entertain temptation and dismiss it as quickly as possible, those who are foolish are corrupted and controlled by it. Perhaps while Sauron serves as a force of malice upon the land. He benefits from the destructive ramifications of prideful actions of everyone else. Primarily Sauraman, Boromir, and Denethor. However, Sauron still lost. His pride led to his downfall, the same happened for each other character on this list. Frodo's humility, empathy, and compassion are what saved him because he spared Gollum. So I guess what I'm saying is that the Sauron is his own worst enemy as well as everyone else's because of pride.
     
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  10. BalrogRingDestroyer

    BalrogRingDestroyer Member

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    Actually, we do kind of directly see him:

    He talked to Pippin. Also, I think that we knew his thought right when Frodo claimed the Ring.
     
  11. Kharina

    Kharina New Member

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    Sauron, though by this I include the Ring given that the Ring is basically part of Sauron.

    I think 'evil as a force' is an interesting option, and I think LOTR definitely acknowledges that defeating one villian won't get rid of all evil or stop evil from ever 'coming back' ever again, but I think the common understanding of the term villian would relate to a character or characters in a story rather than 'evil' as a force. I also don't believe that evil as a force exists in the real world- I think there are evil (and good) actions that come about as the result of individual people's choices (or the choices of groups). So to me it makes more sense to pick a person in the story who a) acts as an antagonist, as that's part of the definition of a villian to me, and b) makes a lot of evil choices (with Sauron by the time of LOTR it seems to be pretty much always evil choices!)
     

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