why the Valar did nothing to pursue Melkor?

Discussion in '"The Silmarillion"' started by Pontin, Feb 18, 2018.

  1. Pontin

    Pontin New Member

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    as we know there are many wars of Beleriand as melkor (or Morgoth) destroys the lands, but why for the longest time the Valar did nothing to stop Morgoth from destroying Beleriand and doing his evil? (until the war of wraith). (Edit: opps sorry i posted wrong section)
     
    Last edited: Feb 18, 2018
  2. Rána

    Rána Wayward

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    I've been looking at this one with eager anticipation, but I haven't been able to sit down with texts to find the correct passages and build a proper literary conclusion... so I'll kind of wing it first.

    I would say that some of it is fear based. There's a period before the awakening of the Elves where they really back off the battles because they're uncertain of where/when the first of the Elder Children are going to appear. I think there's a hesitation of uncertainty involved, even through the after ages.

    There's this whole other side that I've been running around with concerning the basic functions of Melkor though. Just like all of the other beings of Everything, he is just as he was conceived. He's born of the thoughts of Eru, the same as the rest of the Ainur and the Children. I think it's easy to dismiss Melkor as "evil" and his works "unnecessary," but Eru never kicked Melkor out of the band during the early themes of the music. The logic of my mind figures that there has to be some necessary function to Melkor's perspective.

    Isn't it said that Melkor has a share of each of the powers of the Ainur?
    ***I guess here's a good place to explain some of the way in which I perceive the Ainur. You know how they do neurological studies by conducting brain scans while subjects do math problems, or recognize faces, or experience pain, etc...? I imagine that if those different regions that "light up" could achieve a form all their own... that's the best way that I make sense of what it means to be an Ainu.***
    I feel like Melkor fits into that "jack of all trades, master of none" category. He appears to get frustrated by the limited perspectives of the other Valar, yet he's also jealous of the abilities that they have within their scope of Ëa. He has a greater comprehension of the whole, but a very narrow grasp on the individual parts that make up the whole.

    Perhaps the Valar struggle with the concepts in the same way. If the things that Melkor was doing had no place whatsoever in the realm of Eru Ilúvatar, then why doesn't he just lift a hand to silence Melkor? It seems presumptuous on part of the Valar to deem Melkor wholly without merit and to remove his part from the music.

    Then, there's a third part, where I have a sense that his power is just too great for them to overcome for many ages. Perhaps it isn't until the very end, where he's poured so much of his rage and power into other beings (and the world itself) that his power is finally dispersed enough to trigger his ultimate downfall. It only goes so far anyway, the darkness of the 3rd Age is still composed of ripples made from Melkor's splashing around.
     
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  3. Galadriel Lady Of Light

    Galadriel Lady Of Light New Member

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    To my understanding, they thought that Middle Earth was not under their authority as the elves who resided there had rejected their wisdom and denied the surpreme power of the Vala. The Vala did not want it to seem as if they were forcing their rule on the elves, as that is what they were accused of by Feanor.
     
  4. Cloudhauler

    Cloudhauler Hauler of Clouds

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    Abandoning the elves that refused the summons makes sense, but what about the second-born of Eru, Men? The Valar never summoned them anywhere or offered them protection. The Valar really don’t seem to care about Men until after the War of Wrath.
     

  5. Ithilethiel

    Ithilethiel Member

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    You bring up many intetesting points to consider Rána.

    I think it is also important to recall the words of Tulkas spoken at this time, "'Nay! Let us make war swiftly! Have we not rested from strife overlong, and is not our strength now renewed?

    So is not part of the reason the Valar remained idle while Melkor built his stronghold and the evil beings to defend it due to their prior exertions of creation?

    Yet Manwë resisted still as the Valar feared the coming of the elves into darkness thus causing Varda to create the many stars for the coming of the Firstborn. It was the greatest labor of the Valar and the most strenuous. And with Menelmacar, "with its shining belt" not only did the Firstborn appear but as well it served as a foretelling of the Last Battle.

    And as well it can be said that Melkor's greatest evils were preserved for the Quendi. It was only then that the Council made haste to protect the Firstborn from the evils of Melkor and gain control of Arda. Yet from the Battle and the subsequent summoning we have the first sundering of the elves.

    So good and bad resulted from the encounter. And just as in all epics and especially in those of fantasy, proper timing is a character in the storytelling. All things in their time as they are so ordained.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2018
  6. Kinofnerdanel

    Kinofnerdanel New Member

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    Oh, this one sip of a glorious thought made the registration absolutely worth it :D

    Still, I have to follow in the same manner, sadly no quote, but the Valar said (if you pardon me that unscholarly expression) something like their battles against Melkor scarred the world so terribly that they were worried about hurting seriously these short-lived, fragile Secondborns.
     
  7. Ron Simpson

    Ron Simpson Petty Dwarf

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    A useful response may depend on whether you believe the Valar to be rational in their actions. Many believe they are not (see http://www.thetolkienforum.com/inde...rebellion-are-the-valar-really-to-blame.6552/).

    I think Manwe & Co. make many odd decisions for which the Eldar ultimately suffer. Perhaps they couldn't control Melkor, perhaps they couldn't even fathom Melkor. First he topples their lamps, and they actually drop the ball a second time, and he blights their trees ..... they couldn't even take care of their own lighting, much less the Elves. Maybe Manwe & Co. weren't all they were cracked up to be. They were far better at making stuff - than exercising good parenting.
     
    Last edited: Jul 6, 2018

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