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Denethors favouritism

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Harad

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Because Boromir is more like Denethor. They both are proud and insular. They dislike the meddling of Gandalf and do not want a King to take over from the Steward. Also Boromir is more accomplished as a warrior. Faramir is more of an interationalist, a fan of Gandalf, and not so proud that he would be antagonistic toward Aragorn.
 

Legolam

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Three theories:

1. The eldest child thing. Parents always like the older one more (sorry guys, but it's true!)
2. Boromir was more like his father in mind and body than Faramir
3. Boromir didn't try and suck up to the wandering crackpot wizard and, to Denethor's eyes at least, loved his father more than Faramir.
 

Khamul

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IMO, Faramir gave much more thought to Gandalf's counsel than Boromir. And Denethor seemed to feel jealous when I was reading the books. Denethor wished for more control over his sons. And he also feels animosity about Gandalf (from Sauron's influence in the Palantir) and blames all of his troubles upon Gandalf.
 

Hama

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Faramir is also not nearly as blind in following orders as Boromir. He was rational and thought for himself where as Boromir did whatever his father said. Look over the part where Faramir is talking to Frodo in Ithilien. For the most part, the reasons of Denethor's partiality have already been given, so I don't need to reiterate them.
 

Beleg Strongbow

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Originally posted by Hama
Faramir is also not nearly as blind in following orders as Boromir. He was rational and thought for himself where as Boromir did whatever his father said. Look over the part where Faramir is talking to Frodo in Ithilien. For the most part, the reasons of Denethor's partiality have already been given, so I don't need to reiterate them.

Harad summed it up poerfectley. There is your answer.:) :) ;) :cool:
 

Hama

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Sorry...uhm...this is Hama - H A M A, not to be confused with H A R A D.
 

Eonwe

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sort of said in other posts, but here goes:

One of the things Denethor is pretty upset about is how his father Ecthelion liked Thorongil (Aragorn using an alias in his youth in Gondor) so much. And I think this is reflected in Denethor saying to Gandalf that Boromir was no "wizard's pupil" like Faramir. Thorongil was a rival to Denethor to the people of Gondor, since he did much good while he was there. And I suppose that Gandalf probably pushed Thorongil in any of his visits to Minas Tirith to Ecthelion. Faramir took a liking to Gandalf early on, and learned much from him (including all of his names it seems, for which we get a clue "Olorin" as to which Maia he was). So perhaps, Denethor sees the same thing happening to Faramir as what happened to his father Ecthelion, that he listens to Gandalf for counsel.

Gandalf for his part says that the blood of Numenor runs nearly true in Denethor somehow, and that the same is true of Faramir, but not Boromir.

EDIT: I found this in Appendix A of RotK, I had forgotten:

"Denethor II was a proud man, tall, valiant, and more kingly than any man that had appeared in Gondor for many lives of men; and he was wise also, and far-sighted, and learned in lore. Indeed he was as like to Thorongil as to one of nearest kin, and yet was ever placed second to the stranger in the hearts of men and the esteem of his father. At the time many thought that Thorongil had departed before his rival became his master; though indeed Thorongil had never himself vied with Denethor, nor held himself higher than the servant of his father. And in one matter only were their counsels to the Steward at variance: Thorongil often warned Ecthelion not to put trust in Saruman the White in Isengard, but to welcome rather Gandalf the Grey. But there was little love between Denethor and Gandalf; and after the days of Ecthelion there was less welcome for the Grey Pilgrim in Minas Tirith. Therefore later, when all was made clear, many believed that Denethor, who was subtle of mind and looked further and deeper than other men of his day, had discovered who this stranger Thorongil in truth was, and suspected that he and Mithrandir designed to supplant him."

Pretty clear, seeing that Faramir was fond of Gandalf, why Denethor wasn't as happy with him as with Boromir.
 
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Hama

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It's great what all comes out of the Appendix. I had read that portion and was frantically looking through the Silmarillion and UT thinking I had seen it there. It's funny but it was in the LotR all along. Thanks for that quote, Eonwe, I had forgotton about that angle completely. By the way, what do the people of Gondor, Denethor included, think happened to Thorongil. Did he just vanish? Or did he feign dying in battle. And what did Aragorn say were his origins? Is it given anywhere?
 

Grond

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Somewhere in a Tolkien story.
From Appendix A of The Lord of the Rings,
"...He sent a message of farewell to Ecthelion, saying; 'Other tasks now call me, lord, and much time and many perils must pass, ere I come again to Gondor, if that be my fate.' Though none could guess what those tasks might be, nor what summons he had received, it was known whither he went. For he took boat and crossed over Anduin, and there he said farewell to his companions and went on alone; and when he was last seen his face was towards the Mountains of Shadow..."

Maybe Gandalf and the other Wise wanted someone to take a look in Mordor to see what was cooking, so they sent a messenger to tell him to "Head East young man!!" Who else do they have that could make such a journey if not the rightful heir to Isildur? After all, it's his line's fault that Sauron is still around and kicking at all. :)
 

Tao

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Didn't it say in the book that Faramir was more like Denethor, but he still liked Boromir better? I'm not quite sure...I can't remember.

I believe the reasons he favors Boromir over Faramir are the fact that [1.] Boromir is more of an adventurer, and more disrespectful to Gandalf, who Denethor thought didn't like very much (it shows it in 'The Pyre of Denethor', when Denethor is going slightly mad :D). [2.] Like Legolam said, Boromir is older, and has seen more in his life time. His experience is also a trait that Denethor likes. And [3.] I thik Denethor likes Boromir's spirit about Minas Tirith.


ALTHOUGH he did want Faramir to die along with him when he could of recovered...I wonder if he would have done the same with Boromir? or would he try to heal him?
 

LadyGaladriel

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faramir was "a wizards pupil"
Hey just a thought
do you think denethor could have been jelous of Gandalf about how Faramir looked up to him?
 

Legolam

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Tao - i remember that it said somewhere in LOTR that Faramir was indeed more like Denethor than Boromir. I don't have my books here, but maybe someone could have a scout for that quote :confused:
 

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