馃 The Tolkien Forum 馃

Welcome to our forum! Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox! Plus you won't see ads ;)

Gimli, son of Gl贸in and the Ring

D谩in Ironfoot I

Vive la revolution!
Joined
Dec 1, 2002
Messages
973
Reaction score
0
Location
ME-RPG
Gimli, son of Gl贸in represents friendship and companionship within the Fellowship, and remained so even after it was broken. Whether this Dwarf is tending a fire, rambling of the wonders of Moria, slaying Orcs at Helm's Deep, or smoking a relaxing pipe in Isengard, he is always portrayed as a kind and thoughtful character. He never thinks of himself first, but instead the greater task at hand. Examples of this are the Paths of the Dead, and going into Lothlorien despite fears of an Elven witch. All he craves is equality, and understanding, and in turn he risks his very life, as he did when he saved Eomer.

Yet why would the Wise willingly place a Dwarf with the Fellowship, when such an object was in their hands? It is said that the hearts of Dwarves crave such golden trinkets, and the One Ring especially should have sent them berserk. Even the Seven drove them mad, and they did not even wear them in public due to their own greed. So if the One was even more powerful than the Seven, why was Gimli not tempted by it? Dwarves- whom would willingly die for something like the Arkenstone, and whom lusted for the Seven in years past, would surely crave the small band of gold that Sauron forged in the fires of Mt. Doom!

So how could Gimli even resist such a thing? If Dwarves are so greedy and driven mad by Silmarils, the Seven, and the Arkenstone, (all things of little power compared to the One) why did this lone Dwarf not lust for the One? Why would the Council even desire a Dwarf to be there in such an important quest, did they know something we do not?

I have a few open ended possibilites on Gimli's uniqueness. The first one is with Dwarves in general. Is it that Dwarves crave power, or simply beauty? The Silmarils and the Arkenstone are examples of this, but the Seven are unclear. The One was not strikingly beautiful, but I still dont understand why it did not tempt him. Was it because the One could not corrupt a Dwarf as Sauron wanted perhaps a Man to be? Maybe the thick skin and head of the Naugrim shielded Gimli from the One's whispers?

My favorite (and possibly most far-fetched conclusion) has to do with Galadriel. We all know how Gimli adored this woman, so much that he perhaps abandoned his fate in the Halls of Aule and sailed to the West to meet her again. It is said of Dwarf men and women that if they desire a mate, and they cannot obtain him/her, they continue to lust after him/her and will marry no other. I wouldnt call Gimli's love for Galadriel lust, but I prefer to think of it as a unique blend between the natural born love for beauty in Dwarves and Gimli's own admiration. Perhaps his absolute admiration and love for Galadriel empowered him with a different kind of resistance, as if he was already taken with another. I think that those three golden hairs had more power to them then what the Ring could even hope to do to Gimli. Those hairs reminded him always of Galadriel, and if the Ring ever snuck up on him, he was able to take his attention away from it and focus dreamily on the Lady. What an interesting concept! That a Dwarf's absolute love for the most powerful Elf in ME could be more potent than the One Ring itself.

But the question is still unanswered, and I would like to hear any thoughts on this matter. Why was Gimli not tempted by the Ring, even though it was near him the whole time?
 

Celebth么l

Loremaster
Joined
Oct 2, 2002
Messages
2,413
Reaction score
3
Thats an interesting and....unique thought there :D

I recon, that it was because Dwarves are resisitant to magic, and like you said, the ring wasnt strikingly (sp) beautiful.
Though i like your Galadriel idea better :)
 

YayGollum

Conscience of TTF
Joined
Dec 3, 2001
Messages
5,538
Reaction score
6
Location
Columbia, South Carolina, the United States of Nor
What says that the One Ring should especially send Dwarves berserk? Or did you just come up with that from the rest of that sentence? I don't know.

What says that the seven Dwarf rings made them go mad? I just thought that it made them unnaturally greedy.

Why do you think that the silmarils were weaker than the One Ring? Sounds crazy to me.

I wouldn't say that Dwarves crave power or beauty. Sounds like you think of them as brainless types who all have to think the same. I'd like to think that they have a little more free will than that. Not every single one craves anything special. Do you think that other races all crave certain things all the time? Creepy. Now I gots to feel sorry for them. oh well.

The Sil. said that Dwarves were made specifically to not get corrupted by Mel, who was definitely a lot more evil and scary and powerful than Sauron. The seven Dwarf rings were made specifically to corrupt people. They didn't work on the Dwarves as well as Sauron hoped, though. The One Ring was made specifically for Sauron to use. Not to corrupt people, but for him to use to corrupt people through the other rings. Also, sure, to bring himself back to life all the time. Gimli wasn't tempted because he was made to not get corrupted. Simple.
 

Glomund

Registered User
Joined
Nov 5, 2002
Messages
118
Reaction score
0
Location
A red pillar box, somewhere in Mayfair
My thought on why Gimli was not tempted by the One, and how Dwarves in general would react to the 7 rings or the Arkenstone is one of ownership, The dwarves became greedy with the 7 and would die for the Arkenstone, because these were their individual and racial possessions. The dwarves desire for gold made them seek more and more, and to keep what they had while under the influence of the ring, but only twice have I read where this desire led them to plot theft or murder, when Thorin found that Bard held the Arkenstone, he plotted to backout of his agreement to trade 1/14 of Smaugs horde. The second time is in the Sil when the dwarves of Nogrod kill Thingol and steal the silmaril, but in this case there are four reasons why,
1. Thingol refused to pay them
2. the necklace they set the silmaril into was a dwarven necklace, they considered it to be rightfully theirs
3. the silmaril had to have some influence on them, since they even tempted a Vala
4. Lastly, the necklace and other gold they used had been cursed by Glaurung the dragon.
SO Gimli probably thought of what he might do with the ring if he had it, as all the rest of the fellowship also presumably did. but the friendship he developed with Frodo, and the debt he must have felt he owed due to Bilbos actions,as it says in UT
Dwarves understand devotion to friends and gratitude to those who help them
easily overroad any thoughts he may have harbored to succumb to the ring like Borimir
 

Mithrandread

Registered User
Joined
Jul 15, 2003
Messages
36
Reaction score
0
Location
Right Here
For the rest, they shall represent the other free peoples of the world: Elves, Dwarves, and Men.
FOTR, Ch. III

I believe that part of Gimli's reason for going on the Quest was his hope of finding out any information concerning the fate of Balin, who once travelled with Gl贸in, his father, and Thorin & Company. I don't know if he knew of Gandalf's alternate plan of going through Moria, but he may have had hope. I think that he may have been more concerned about this, and the fear that the Shadow had come to his country, than any power that the Ring may have given him.
 

Eriol

Estel
Joined
Sep 30, 2002
Messages
1,395
Reaction score
3
Location
Ithilien
The Shadow of the Past

Frodo drew out the Ring out of his pocket again and looked at it. It now appeared plain and smooth, without mark or device that he could see. The gold looked very fair and pure, and Frodo thought how rich and beautiful was its colour, how perfect was its roudnness. It was an admirable thing and altogether precious.
I don't think we can state that "the Ring is not strikingly beautiful". I think it quite likely that anyone who beheld it would think it more beautiful than the Arkenstone, for instance. It's a magical Ring, after all :D. But we have never seen a character consider the Ring without thinking it immensely beautiful and "covetable". It is not easy to separate aesthetic judgments from the magic of the Ring.

I think racial statements in Tolkien world, even if we take into account that his races are biologically real, being separate creations, should not be accepted uncritically. All of them share the Flame Imperishable, and this means they have free will. "Dwarves are greedy" is at best a statistical statement, and therefore there will be ungreedy dwarves as well as overgreedy dwarves. Gimli does not strike me as exceptional in that regard; he was just as trustworthy as all the company, including Boromir by the way, at first.

The question "Why was not Gimli tempted by the Ring" must be asked of Legolas, and of the other hobbits, and of Aragorn, Boromir and Gandalf as well; and I think the best answer is that the Ring's temptation is proportionate to the stature of the tempted person. It was very great for Gandalf, very great for Aragorn and Boromir, lords of men, "ordinary" temptation for Gimli and Legolas, who were not commanders or leaders, and negligible to the hobbits, for the same reason added to their natural common sense (as seen when Sam is tempted). The ratio of temptation/personal resistance was greatest with Boromir, and this is why he was the first to "snap"; eventually all would have snapped, down to Sam himself, if given enough time.

We see that Boromir fell precisely because the Shadow was attacking his country; so that the speculation that Gimli did not fall because he feared the Shadow in his own country seems odd to me. The more Gimli feared that, the greater would be the temptation for seizing the Ring and solving the problem.

As for Galadriel, I do not see Gimli's love as being sexual in nature; the sexual instinct is usually adapted to the female of the race, Gimli probably would find a beautiful female dwarf more sexually attractive than Galadriel. What happened between them was not only the realization of Galadriel's immense beauty (the Sil has some pretty strong words about that; Galadriel is right up there with L煤thien and Arwen in words of praise, both for her beauty and for her spirit); but also the gratitude for Galadriel's kind words and acceptance when all Gimli expected was enmity and hatred. He pledged his heart to her memory; this is not necessarily sex-based. And in the end, the Ring would have overcome his love for Galadriel; in fact, he would probably have used his word as a temptation. I'm not sure that it helped Gimli; the Ring was really "focusing" at Boromir at the time, and I think this is the best explanation for the resistance of the others. The Ring is just as wily as Sauron...

I wrote a lot :D
 

33Peregrin

hmmm
Joined
Jan 11, 2003
Messages
890
Reaction score
4
Location
school or work
This is my opinion on why Gimli hardly thought\ cared about the ring. First of all- Tolkien never really went into any description of what Gimli thought about the ring, or how much he might have ever been tempted by it. I mean-what if something happened- like he found it laying by the highway or something? Would he just leave it alone if he knew what it was? Gimli probably never really had a chance to start seriously desiring the ring. After Boromir tried to take it, Frodo decided to leave the company. His reason ( I think, I don't have the books here) was something like ' some I cannot trust, and some are to dear to me.' I know Frodo said this before he knew about Boromir's fall, but do you think Frodo trusted all of the fellowship completely besides Boromir? He probably trusted all of the hobbits completely- then there were Gimli, Legolas and Aragorn. But still- who knows what would have happened with all of the members of the Fellowship if Frodo had never left them?
 

D谩in Ironfoot I

Vive la revolution!
Joined
Dec 1, 2002
Messages
973
Reaction score
0
Location
ME-RPG
Gross. No way did I even say that he loved Galadriel in a sexual nature. He loved her with great and honest admiration, so much that he changed his fate for her. I am good enough to realize that! :p
 

Eriol

Estel
Joined
Sep 30, 2002
Messages
1,395
Reaction score
3
Location
Ithilien
Originally posted by D谩in Ironfoot I
Gross. No way did I even say that he loved Galadriel in a sexual nature. He loved her with great and honest admiration, so much that he changed his fate for her. I am good enough to realize that! :p
That's a relief; your talk about Dwarves' desires for mates misled me there.

:)
 

Corvis

Registered User
Joined
Aug 29, 2004
Messages
159
Reaction score
0
Location
The Withywindle Path
First of all gimili was not completely selfless for he insisted Legolas to be blind folded when they were led to Lorien in the Fellowship when he was instructed to. And why i think the ring did not tempt Gimili is because he was one of the greater dwarves I believe and was much more focused and determined on destroying it. And i also do not think that the one ring or any rings drove the dwarves mad.
 

Thread suggestions

Top