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Scouring of the Shire? out?

Mithrandir_II

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Whats this about the Scouring of the Shire not being in the movies??? THATS MY FAVORITE CHAPTER!!!

and if Scouring is out... what will become of Saruman? Will he be killed in TT at Orthanc? Will he just be set free after being rid of his powers, and wander Middle Earth?
 

Rosie Cotton

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Even though TSOTS is one of my favorite chapters also, and is one of the saddest changes for me, it would definately make a rather anti-climatic ending for a movie. I wish that they weren't cutting it, but you have to admit, the people who weren't familliar with the books would definately find it unesseccary and annoying.
 

chrome_rocknave

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Yeah....that parts out :( I think Saruman dies on a spiky wheel thingy right? Anyways, I have to agree that the scouring of the shire would make a terrible ending! After sitting on the edge of my seat the whole time I would hate to see Hobbiton destroyed at the end!
 
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Elin

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I understand what some of you may mean by calling the Scouring an anti-climatic ending, but I think it's very integral to the theme of the whole Tale. Remember, as they come to Bywater, "...there they had their first really painful shock. This was Frodo and Sam's own country, and they found out now that they cared about it more than any other place in the world."

Think in terms of an English soldier in WWII, coming home after many battles, and finding that his London home was demolished in the Blitz. The emotions inherent in this scene could be a powerful part of a movie - why not?

In the very end of the story, Frodo has to leave the Shire. As he states, "I tried to save the Shire, and it has been saved, but not for me."

If the Shire was left untouched during the entire War of the Ring, it's as though all hobbitry were allowed to continue living completely oblivious to the existence of the evil around them. But if indeed they suffered as well, then they have the opportunity to learn to appreciate their "tight little island" all the more, something that really comes out in the book, I believe. And it makes Frodo's sacrifice all that more poignant.

From one point of view, I can see that the story is really about hobbits (it's supposedly written by one) and how they see themselves in the world. The Scouring of the Shire might not fit into PJ's action picture, but it's an essential chapter in the Red Book.

Elin
 

Orin

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The scouring of the Shire was my favorite part as well. Now that I've read the book at least 20 times, I find myself just reading selected bits. And, the Scouring is always one of those bits. In the mirror of Galadriel, they showed Sam's vision of the Shire to Frodo with the orcs leading hobbits in chains. do you think they are going to leave that unaddressed and leave the Scouring out?
 
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Elin

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Orin, I wondered about this, also. But I suppose that what Frodo saw in the mirror (what Sam saw, in the book) could be used just as a warning. In the movie, doesn't Galadriel say to Frodo something like, "This is what MIGHT happen if you don't succeed." Therefore, it never has to actually take place.

Harad, yeah, I agree with what you said. WRT ending with the Grey Havens, I suppose they could find a way to put that in after a short bit about the hobbits returning to the (unscathed) Shire. Guess we'll just have to hope and wait! :)
 

Mithrandir_II

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If the scouring is out... do you think maybe instead of going back to the shire, pippen stays in Gondor and Merry goes to Rohan. Frodo goes to the Havens and Sam goes back to the Shire?

Merry and Pippen certainly wouldn't fit in in an untouched Shire...
they changed so much. Frodo may go back for a while before departing for the Havens and Sam is the only one with much of a reason for going back (Rosie).

I dunno, I'm just thinking out loud -- er -- on-line...
 
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ReadWryt

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...if you can find a copy of Sauron Defeated, which is the 9th book in the History of Middle-earth series, then you should take a good look in there because it has something like 4 different drafts of the Scouring. It's really telling of the adoration and respect that Tolkien had for the Hobbits, and how much he wanted to get it just right. It also has an alternate ending, an Epilogue, in which Sam is sitting in his house with Elanor on the evening in March of 1436. It's Elanor's birthday and he is reading aloud from The Red Book to young Frodo, Merry and Pippin (his sons) and Rosie and Elanor. It's a very touching scene, as you might suspect, because Sam dearly misses his Master Frodo. I suspect that Jackson is going to make this, or some version of it, the ending...I have no real evidence other then the credit of Elanor Gamgee in the cast listing...*Shrug* I can think of worse things to do then fade from Frodo, Bilbo, Elrond and Galadriel sailing off to the west to an older Sam (18 years have passed!) entertaining his older kids with tales of wonder and adventure...
 

Thorin

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I had heard rumor that the ending of the movie was going to be a voice over (and described scenes) of Frodo (Elijah) telling of the death of Aragorn and the going to Lorien and death of Arwen (Hence the footage of Liv Tyler on a bed of rose petals or something like that??). My guess is after Aragorn and Arwen are wed (after the "you may kiss the bride" scene which is inevitable), the Frodo voice over begins and sums up the story.
 

Ragnarok

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IT ENDS WITH THE LAST SCENE AS THE MARRIAGE!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!??!?!?!?!?!!??!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That would be too much, I would boo. And just throw popcorn at everything and be like, WTF! Worst ending ever!

They have to put Scouring in, that was the best. Its cool how Tolkien did that. I hope it ends with Sam 'Well, Im back.' Its my favorite line.
 
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ReadWryt

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There is no way they are going to slam the breaks on the film with the Scouring...It makes for great reading, but it would drag the ending down and make for a real let down after everything preceeding...
 

Dengen-Goroth

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The Last Scene will not be the wedding. As far as I've heard Frodo will sum up the rest, and I think the last scene would be the curtain of rain unurling and seeing at last Vainor in the distance.
 
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Elin

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Originally posted by Dengen-Goroth
The Last Scene will not be the wedding. As far as I've heard Frodo will sum up the rest, and I think the last scene would be the curtain of rain unurling and seeing at last Vainor in the distance.
Now THAT is something I would love to see.

Elin
 

safari

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it might work if...

the only way the scouring of the shire could work is to have it after the credits along with leaving for the GHs. this way those who want a traditional "americian" ending get it those of us who think that tsots is important get it... but don't hold your breath because i'm sure i read in s(c)ript mag that its out....
 

safari

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harad's ideas of australian cinematic endings

dear harad,

i've watched a lot of world cinema, and most american films stick to the formula of "big battle" as climax and "everyone is happy" as final moments. Australian cinema to my knowledge has never finnished with a "prawn on the barbeque" (yes they had to change a prawn into a shrimp, so the usa could understand), if you could tell us all what films your refering too i would be most pleased, if not your comments will be taken as more racist dogma ( i do note that you don't tell people where your based).
 

safari

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as you have put "world" in inverted commas so i also put "amercian" in inverted commas to indicate the prodominate hollywood block buster gene that LOTR is labled as. And as such i should have been more specific about my definitions but my basic thesis still holds true... big action scene... happy ever after...

but harad which australian films end with a bbq? u've not answered that...
 

safari

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i'm rather amused, you've once again ignored what was a comment that compared the two lines of thinking on these pages. why r u so touchy about america's place in the world? i wasn't having a go at blockbusters, lotr falls into that category. just because a film fits the "blockbuster" formula doesn't make it good or bad cinema.

i thought this was a place to debate aspects of the film.
 

DGoeij

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Can we leave cross-Pacific Ocean quarrels to personal messages?

Here a post of my own, originally a comment on a thread called "Elves at Helms Deep?" Covers this subject also pretty well:

>>>> Why not let Arwen the Mighty, piggy-ride Frodo into Mordor, tossing him with Ring and all into the fires of mount Doom, while Sam is being eaten by Shelob?
Merry gets slain by the Lord of the Nazgul, so Arwen gets the chance to stick a sword up the neck of the number one ringwraight.
Pippin ends up as a M.I.A. after the battle at the Morannon (big Olog-Hai, very hungry, small hobbit, y'know).
No hobbits returning home, no need for a scouring of the Shire.
Or am I letting go my sarcasm too much? <<<<<

Hope it will work out a little better than this.:D
 

tookish-girl

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I thought that "shimp on the barbie" joke was funny, but judging by the hammer and tongs incident that's passed now I'm not so sure. To be honest I'm not sure if I want the film to end with Frod, Gandalf and Bilbo all going to the grey Havens, it makes me feel so sad that they don't just all stay in the Shire. But then again, not sure what Frodo would think, living in Bag End with Sam, Rosie and 13 kids|!
 

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