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Was Frodo Inconsiderate?

JanitorofAngmar

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So I just finished the LOTR for the 23rd time (24th? maybe). I couldn't help but notice that he intended to leave ME from the Grey Havens without saying good-bye to Merry & Pippin. Gandalf tipped them off that he was leaving for ever and they hurried to say good-bye.

What a jerk! I can't beleive that he would call them his friends, then leave ME forever without so much as a "have a nice life". Why did he do that?

I could be argued that much like when he left the shire he did not want to drag anyone into his affairs for good or evil. Well, I don't think that going to the Grey Havens would have entailed any danger at all yet he still didn't bother. It seems a little selfish coming from Frodo.

Anyone have any insights into this? It's kinda bugging me.

JoA
 

Mr. Underhill

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Maybe he just wanted to slip away without the fuss of an emotional good-bye ... to sail quietly off into the sunset. I'm sure he was greatly humbled to be allowed to sail to Valinor and perhaps didn't want to appear that he was better than any of the other hobbits.
 

Tyaronumen

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Give the poor 'obbit a break. After everything he'd been through, he couldn't be expected to be 'emotionally considerate'. :D :D
 

Lantarion

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Heh, for a while there I though you meant hemotionally ('obbit, 'emotionally). :)
I find Frodo a real sniff-necked and gloomy philosopher-wannabe. He says very little that I find amusing or funny, and most of his sentences are things like, "I wonder if I shall ever look down into this valley again". And when he realizes he has the upper hand, he becomes all 'royal' and 'noble'. Stuck up elf-friend.. :)
 

Scooter

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Actually, I suspect it was written that way for literary reasons: Tolkien wanted to give the reader some suspense about what was going to happen. If he'd written about Frodo's plans to go to Valinor and about all of his goodbyes, the end would have lacked the solemn resolution that the final copy does. Instead you have Gandalf divining Frodo's deep desires to see his friends one last time and their beautiful, peaceful parting.

For those of us prone to existential projection, we can also imagine that Frodo did say goodbye to his friends in the Shire in his own quiet way . . .
 

Tyaronumen

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Originally posted by Pontifex
Heh, for a while there I though you meant hemotionally ('obbit, 'emotionally). :)
I find Frodo a real sniff-necked and gloomy philosopher-wannabe. He says very little that I find amusing or funny, and most of his sentences are things like, "I wonder if I shall ever look down into this valley again". And when he realizes he has the upper hand, he becomes all 'royal' and 'noble'. Stuck up elf-friend.. :)
*laugh* I love the part where Pippin mocks Frodo for wandering around muttering "I wonder if I shall ever see this place again", etc...

Frodo is stiff-necked (I think 'sniff-necked' might go for Gollum.. :D) and gloomy... but remember that the ring is one hell of a burden! The guy has the short end of the stick all the way through this book right up until the last moment in Orodruin when he finally fails in his task and luckily Gollum recaptures the ring.

I think that this is the true reason that Frodo becomes 'royal' and 'noble'. His will having failed utterly at the last moment, but still being redeemed...? I think this might cause me to become a better person too (although I might be able to crack a joke here and there as well on occasion).

Don't forget that Frodo's parents drowned while he was still fairly young... that might have made him a bit more dour.
 

Tyaronumen

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Just wanted to add my impression, which is that Frodo never really healed or escaped from the influence of the Ring (not to mention the Morgul blade, Shelob, and perhaps even his time in Cirith Ungol) until he passed into the Utmost West.

He mentions the 'Wheel of Fire' burning in his mind at one point in the books... can't remember when. But I think that perhaps this wound was only truly assuaged by the grace of the Valar in Aman.
 

Beorn

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It is known that he did not heal after Shelob or the attack at Weathertop: Check Appendix B...For the years listed after 3019 (the War of the Ring) you see Frodo sick on March Somethingth, and I think October 6th...The dates of his injures
 

Tyaronumen

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Originally posted by Mike B
It is known that he did not heal after Shelob or the attack at Weathertop: Check Appendix B...For the years listed after 3019 (the War of the Ring) you see Frodo sick on March Somethingth, and I think October 6th...The dates of his injures
Mike B, I said "not to mention the attack by Shelob and Morgul blade, etc, etc." because that was not what I was referring to. I was referring to the influence of the Ring upon Frodo's itty-witty brain.
 

Rosie Cotton

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Gee, I've always thought that Frodo didn't say goodbye to Merry and Pippin because he didn't want them to see the pain that he felt, and he wanted to slip away, sparing them the pain of a big goodbye. I know that there isn't to much logic in that, but I really like Frodo, and I guess I just couldn't accept that he would be cold-hearted.
 

Ness

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Maby he didnt say goodbye because he wanted to disapear like bilbo did, you know he was always thinking about how what he did mirrored the tings that bilbo did, so i think that it was proably because he was trying to follow bilbo's example.
 
R

ReadWryt

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Frodo was in the midst of an inner turmoil that is not at first blush apparent, but when one scratches the surface, one sees that he did not think all that highly of himself and so perhaps did not want any fuss over his leaving.

From #246 of the Yr. 2000 edition of The Letters of J.R.R. Tolkien

He appears at first to have had no feeling of guilt (III 224-5); he was restored of sanity and peace. But then he thought that he had given his life in sacrifice: he expected to die very soon. But he did not, and one can observe the disquiet growing in him. Arwen was the first to observe the signs, and gave him her jewel for comfort, and thought of a way of healing him. Slowly he fades `out of the picture', saying and doing less and less. I think it is clear on reflection to an attentive reader that when his dark times came upon him and he was concious of being `wounded by knife sting and tooth and a long burden' (III 268) it was not only nightmare memories of past horrors that afflicted him, but also unreasoning self reproach; he saw himself and all that he had done as a broken failure. `Though I may come to the Shire, it will not seem the same, for I shall not be the same.' That was actually a temptation out of the Dark, a last flicker of Pride: desire to have returned as a `hero', not content with being a mere instrument of good. And it was mixed with another temptation, blacker and yet (in a sense) more merited, for however that may be explained, he had not in fact cast away the Ring by a voluntary act: he was tempted to regret it's destruction, and still to desire it. `It is gone forever, and now all is dark and empty', he said as he wakened from his sickness in 1420.
I suspect the poor fellow felt unworthy of praise and well wishes as he honestly believed he had been, in the end, a failure and the one thing he had been entrusted to do was that which he failed to do...
 

Kit Baggins

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I've just finished LoTR for bout the third time, and I still don't really get what happens to Frodo and Bilbo at the end. I mean, where is it they actually go, and what happens to them :confused: ?

Or am I not supposed to ask these kinds of questions?

~Kit :confused:
 

Scooter

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By all means ask Kit, for there is an answer!

The really is no short answer to your question but I'll do my best: In the west is the spirit world of the Valar (sort of the gods of Middle Earth though they don't directly interfere with its events). When elves grow weary of middle earth they depart by way of the Grey Havens to live in west as their "true" spirit selves. Mortals (like Frodo and Bilbo) may not normally take that route but because of their role regarding the ring they received "special dispensation" to go west where they can finally be free of their burden.

Another way to put it is: they went to heaven, only without all of the Judeo-Christian connotations that brings up . . .

The best way for you to get an answer to that question is to read the Silmarillion -- it can be a daunting task at first (kinda like reading the Old Testament) but it really gives you the full picture of Middle Earth.

LotR will be in a much larger context: all of the historical references will be explained, Sauron's origins, where Balrogs come from, why Elrond is called "half-elven" -- O so many things!

Good luck!
 

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